Adventurer's Club Rumors?

[Ian]

The Adventurer's Club lost money....

that is unacceptible at a place that was built to generate profits....

people still seem to be having a hard time with this concept

Huh. Did it really? I've never heard that before.

I'm amazed that a place that sold $7 beers couldn't make a profit.

[Dsnygirl]

To be sure WDW is a very unique place. But not everything in the World should be viewed the same way. There are other theme parks in the world, with rollercoasters and dark rides. There are other entertainment districts with dancing and comedy. There are other places with stage shows and interesting dining venues. But i can't think of any place quite like the Adventurers Club. It was one of the truely unique Disney creations.
The Adventurers Club does not deserve its fate.

You have a very valid point, one that I sure wish Disney would consider!

I'm sure it's been discussed from this angle -- esp. with all the sites out there dedicated to the AC and the desire to see it re-opened.... all we can do is hope at this point that Disney will reconsider and give us a much needed surprise, as what they've come out with as "surprises and celebrations" for this year so far has been pretty lame...

[lockedoutlogic]

How much money is a greeting area making?

I have already heard of a number of families that are cutting down the frequency and/or duration of their visits, because of the closing of the AC. Some do not renew their annual passes. So by closing the AC, they not only reduced their costs and missed the revenue of the AC, but also the revenue in shops, restaurants, tickets, etc. will drop.

greeting areas have minimal overhead......bars do not.

and since they closed the entire gated area of PI....it's not the AC specifically that would cause a dip in annual pass revenue...

and for that matter...the cost of an annual pass, combined with an annual to PI...is still less than a premium annual pass....

so for their truly to be a drop off in annual pass sales....that would mean people were paying $500.00 a year for a pass and didn't care about the waterparks and disneyquest....which isn't how the WDW annual passholder would typically think....

[TheRustyScupper]

. . . It seems that Disney management looks at the World as if everything is equal. To be sure WDW is a very unique place. But not everything in the World should be viewed the same way. There are other theme parks in the world . . .

1) Actually, they don't acknowledge other parks.
2) They recognize them, but don't acknowledge them.
3) They talk about "The Others", in almost a derogatory tone.
4) Many WDW managers are still in their own little world (pun unintended).

[lockedoutlogic]

Huh. Did it really? I've never heard that before.

I'm amazed that a place that sold $7 beers couldn't make a profit.

when the announcement made...CMs from PI had said that the company line was that they had a $1 millon dollar loss on the AC alone....if i recall correctly....

Now...that's number twisting....we all know....

But this "great" place that everyone now laments could only hold about 150 people....it seldom had more than 50.....the average time someone was in there seemed to be about 15 minutes.....and no one really seemed to be drinking....

...in fact....it always appeared that half of the "patrons" at any given time were cast (not too hard to spot)....and I can assure you: they weren't buying $7 drinks.....that's like....and hour and a half's pay

[lockedoutlogic]

1) Actually, they don't acknowledge other parks.
2) They recognize them, but don't acknowledge them.
3) They talk about "The Others", in almost a derogatory tone.
4) Many WDW managers are still in their own little world (pun unintended).

you are right on all accounts....but unfortunately they've never really had to be accountable to the market.....

as long as everyone is "hurrying" to buy their new 200 point interest BLT, AKV, THV at $112.00 a point.....

[Cinderelley]

But this "great" place that everyone now laments could only hold about 150 people....it seldom had more than 50.....the average time someone was in there seemed to be about 15 minutes.....and no one really seemed to be drinking....

...in fact....it always appeared that half of the "patrons" at any given time were cast (not too hard to spot)....and I can assure you: they weren't buying $7 drinks.....that's like....and hour and a half's pay

It was packed when we were there last Sept., and it wasn't half cast members. We could barely find a place to sit.

[lockedoutlogic]

It was packed when we were there last Sept., and it wasn't half cast members. We could barely find a place to sit.

Two questions:

1. Did you notice how much the place could hold? ballpark figure....
2. Are you sure they weren't Cast Members? really sure?

It's not that i doubt what you are saying....but days that play out as you say were few and far between....

I have been to that club probably 30ish times total.....and i can count what I would consider to be "crowded" times on one hand.....and even then....I think there is a 200 capacity on the building anyway (posted right at the front door)

That is in no way the kind a capacity that will stick at WDW......if their rides pack 2500 in an hour.....why would they want an elaborate, staffed bar that only held a fraction of that?

[Cinderelley]

when the announcement made...CMs from PI had said that the company line was that they had a $1 millon dollar loss on the AC alone....if i recall correctly....

Now...that's number twisting....we all know....

But this "great" place that everyone now laments could only hold about 150 people....it seldom had more than 50.....the average time someone was in there seemed to be about 15 minutes.....and no one really seemed to be drinking....

...in fact....it always appeared that half of the "patrons" at any given time were cast (not too hard to spot)....and I can assure you: they weren't buying $7 drinks.....that's like....and hour and a half's pay

I'm not a business person, so explain this to me.
If 25 people come in for 15 minutes and buy one $7 drink. That's $700 in one hour. Correct? The Adventurer's Club is open for 5 hours. That equals $3500 a night. That doesn't include the price of admission - about $22 - an extra $11,000. So, if WDW only pays CMs minimum wage, how can it not be making money?

[lockedoutlogic]

I'm not a business person, so explain this to me.
If 25 people come in for 15 minutes and buy one $7 drink. That's $700 in one hour. Correct? The Adventurer's Club is open for 5 hours. That equals $3500 a night. That doesn't include the price of admission - about $22 - an extra $11,000. So, if WDW only pays CMs minimum wage, how can it not be making money?

They use some "creative" accounting.....

But a 10000 dollar a night take is pitiful by any disney standard....

that literally isn't worth them operating the club.....$350,000 a year? completely devoid of profit by disney's estimation....

Remember: they spent $100 million on Expedition Everest.....reportedly clost to 300 million total on Test Track....and that was in the 90's....

The numbers that Disney cares about at WDW start with "m" and "b"......

Adventurer's Club was a niche sorta place.....but no matter how much I trust Disney's financial figures (I don't...when it comes to WDW operations....by the way)...I know that the AC wasnt' worth their time....in the grand scheme of things.

People should feel very lucky it lasted as long as it did.....

And I would guarantee that Disney could show you a ledger sheet that has a much higher operational expense at the AC than 11,000 a night.....guaranteed

[Ian]

It's not that i doubt what you are saying....but days that play out as you say were few and far between....

This about it, though. Didn't AC close in September? I know they drew massive crowds in the days leading up to its closure, so I don't have any problem believing that if the poster was there in September of '08 it would have been mobbed.

[Cinderelley]

Two questions:

1. Did you notice how much the place could hold? ballpark figure....
2. Are you sure they weren't Cast Members? really sure?


I have been to that club probably 30ish times total.....and i can count what I would consider to be "crowded" times on one hand.....and even then....I think there is a 200 capacity on the building anyway (posted right at the front door)

..if their rides pack 2500 in an hour.....why would they want an elaborate, staffed bar that only held a fraction of that?

If I were to guess at a capacity level, it would probably be way off. My brain just doesn't work well that way. I do think they could've offered more seating. We had to sit up in a little nook on the second floor.

As far as being Cast Members, very few of them were dressed up - unless you're talking about CMs who were off duty. But, I still went with your numbers of 1/2 of the customers being CMs since I know business is not my strong point.

As far as Why they would do it - they do it for Club 33 at Disneyland.

[Cinderelley]

This about it, though. Didn't AC close in September? I know they drew massive crowds in the days leading up to its closure, so I don't have any problem believing that if the poster was there in September of '08 it would have been mobbed.

Sorry, when I posted I was just coming off of a long 12-hour shift at work. We were actually there in Sept. '07. It was still busy though. At one point, we could barely walk as we were trying to get to the bar to try a famous "Kungaloosh". It was worth getting through the sea of bodies though.

[The Joker]

I wás there last September, every night from September 21st until September 27th. (I was blessed to be able to see the final Hoopla...) The Club was packed every single day. On the last day, people formed a line to get in very early in the morning (before 8 AM!). And the majority of these people were not CM's. In total I have been to the Cloob hundreds of times and - travelling from The Netherlands - I hardly qualify as a local or CM... I have seen many easy nights, but that's partly because we always pick low season to visit. On the other hand, I have also witnessed many nights where the bartenders had to work very hard to keep every thirsty throat satisfied. And we know that it's (was) almost impossible to drink so fast that Dana or Laura couldn't keep up...

In addition to the revenue guestimations above, there are also the very profitable private parties, with revenues of 5-20K per event. And there were several of these events each week. If the Cloob was not profitable, then the real problem was not with the Cloob, but with the beancounters...

[lockedoutlogic]

I wás there last September, every night from September 21st until September 27th. (I was blessed to be able to see the final Hoopla...) The Club was packed every single day. On the last day, people formed a line to get in very early in the morning (before 8 AM!). And the majority of these people were not CM's. In total I have been to the Cloob hundreds of times and - travelling from The Netherlands - I hardly qualify as a local or CM... I have seen many easy nights, but that's partly because we always pick low season to visit. On the other hand, I have also witnessed many nights where the bartenders had to work very hard to keep every thirsty throat satisfied. And we know that it's (was) almost impossible to drink so fast that Dana or Laura couldn't keep up...

In addition to the revenue guestimations above, there are also the very profitable private parties, with revenues of 5-20K per event. And there were several of these events each week. If the Cloob was not profitable, then the real problem was not with the Cloob, but with the beancounters...

Instead of the back and forth....let me just wrap this up by putting it this way:

The Adventurer's Club....nor Pleasure Island as a whole.....never generated the kind of revenue that Disney was looking for.....

The "troubles" of that fun, adult palace have been documented since the day it opened....

they pulled the plug.....we probably don't need to rehash the merits.

The AC was a cult kinda place that did not pack any sort of economic punch.....so now it's gone

[Ian]

As far as Why they would do it - they do it for Club 33 at Disneyland.

Oh no ... Club 33 is an entirely different animal.

Club 33 members are privileged with access to the park 365 days a year. Club 33 offers individual and corporate memberships. As of February 2008 the current membership levels are Corporate Membership, Limited Corporate Membership and Gold Membership. The Silver Membership is not currently being offered. As of June 2007, the membership waiting list was 14 years, and membership closed as of April/May 2007.

Those interested in membership must send a written letter of inquiry to Disney and will receive a confirmation letter and information packet. As memberships open, potential members are informed via a letter of intent from Disney.

Initial fees and annual dues vary by membership. The Corporate and Limited Corporate Memberships allow for transfer of members.

The Corporate Membership fee is $27,500 plus $6,100 in annual fees. Up to nine associate members can be designated at an annual fee of $4,650 each. Members no longer in the employment of the corporate member's company must surrender the membership cards to Club 33. The corporate member may then designate another member of the company.

The Limited Corporate Membership fee is $13,750 with only one member at an annual fee of $4,650. This entitles the corporation to transfer the membership to another employee whenever necessary.

The Gold Membership is for an individual with a member fee of $10,450 and an annual fee of $3,275. Additional use of a membership card is by spouse only, with reservations accepted only from the cardholder, the spouse or the cardholder's assistant. The Gold Membership is not transferable.

Club 33 generates plenty of revenue, believe me.

[sillyolbear]

Oh no ... Club 33 is an entirely different animal.

Club 33 generates plenty of revenue, believe me.

Amen to that! We were fortunate enough to dine at Club 33 last fall and I have no doubt they generate a gracious plenty of revenue. For just the two of us dinner with wine was over $250.00 before gratuity.

And I would pay it again just for the experience!

[JRocker]

The Adventurer's Club....nor Pleasure Island as a whole.....never generated the kind of revenue that Disney was looking for.....

So where are you getting the numbers? The real numbers, not the ambiguous statements made at press conferences, or press releases. Where are the numbers?

I'm not saying this to be spiteful, or whatever. I'm just trying to learn a little more about it, and I really want to know where to find the facts.

[The Joker]

Instead of the back and forth....let me just wrap this up by putting it this way:

The Adventurer's Club....nor Pleasure Island as a whole.....never generated the kind of revenue that Disney was looking for.....

The "troubles" of that fun, adult palace have been documented since the day it opened....

they pulled the plug.....we probably don't need to rehash the merits.

The AC was a cult kinda place that did not pack any sort of economic punch.....so now it's gone

You probably missed the fact that the AC was the most profitable club of PI? But the beancounters just preferred to let other business take the risk and open a t-shirt shop that you can find on every corner of the net...

[TinkerbellT421]

Not that it counts for much or even means anything anyway basically because it is all speculation. But I talked to a cast member this week when we were there and as far as they knew it was done, gone for good never to return. Which completely stinks because I wanted to go there and we had plans for it when we were planning this trip but then they gave out the news that PI was closing. So I never did get to experience it. Which was what I was talking about at the time with the CM and asked why the outside of the building wasn't bordered up yet (the building right next to it was, cant remember what the boarded buildings name was) and she said it was finished, done for good, just not boarded up yet.