Allow me to rant for a minute

[DizneyFreak2002]

The fast pass system at universal is to pay an extra $25 or so per day's ticket to get in express line (no assigned times). When we were there 3 years ago the express lines in the Harry potter section were still 30 minutes or more. Rest of the park wasn't crowded and wouldn't need the express line.

Are you sure you were at Islands of Adventure? If you were, you'd know Forbidden Journey does NOT have Express Pass...

[Prudence]

Are you sure you were at Islands of Adventure? If you were, you'd know Forbidden Journey does NOT have Express Pass...

That ride was broken the entire day I was there, so I didn't know that. I was referring to the two roller coasters in that section. The wait for to just enter a gift shop was over 1/2 hour. This was when it was pretty new though. I hated IOA. We have free passes to go back and we're thinking it's too much of a pain to even bother. Of course, our whole purpose in going was to ride the Harry potter thing and we weren't able to do that.

[DizneyFreak2002]

That ride was broken the entire day I was there, so I didn't know that. I was referring to the two roller coasters in that section. The wait for to just enter a gift shop was over 1/2 hour. This was when it was pretty new though. I hated IOA. We have free passes to go back and we're thinking it's too much of a pain to even bother. Of course, our whole purpose in going was to ride the Harry potter thing and we weren't able to do that.

If the ride was down all day, I could see the Express Pass being 30 minutes for Dragon Challenge, though that does seem rather high... Especially for the kiddie coaster, Flight of the Hippogriff...

But, since you said this was 3 years ago, I take it you went in 2010/2011 right when the land first opened... The years where IOA saw a 30% and then a 29% increase in attendance... An attendance jump which caught them off guard to be honest... However, since then, they have learned and things have gotten much better...

Despite still being insanely popular, the crowd control has gotten much much better... If you have free passes, go again... You are missing out on the best themed theme park in Orlando... And it will only be getting better!!!!

[faberj]

I may be alone here, but I love the magic of disney. I think they do an amzaing job with the theming. I am very impressed of what they have done to the Magic Kingdom. The Litte Mermaid ride is awesome! We don't get to Disney all that often either (it is usually several years or more gap between trips) I have been to Universal once (about 6 years ago) and it was ok. I am not a huge thrill ride person so that might be part of it. I also did not feel the Magic at Universal either, felt to me more like a Six Flags theme park. With a 3 yr old DS Universal doesn't offer enough for us as a family to even consdier spending the money to go there. I will go to Legoland and Sea World before I go back to Universal.

[ransam]

Not a big fan of Universal. I've been there a few times and to be honest very unimpressed.
The park is not very well kept up, a lot of chipping paint, not a very good lay out and not a real family atmosphere.
Harry Potter area was cool. but I couldnt' go on the rides because of my size. I'm big, but not that big. Never had a problem on any disney ride, but couldn't ride any of the rides at Universal.
Everyone is entitled to their opinions, but if you really think that Disney is doing nothing, I think that's crazy.
In the last few years-
A complete new fantasyland that is amazing
Opened up Art of Animation Resort
Completely redid California Adventure
Built an awesome new area in California Adventure in Cars Land
Have updated numerous cues and continue on that.
Updated Stars Tours
Opened up a resort in Hawaii
Started a brand new land in Avitar
announced a complete new update to Animal Kingdom that I have seen the plans and it's amazing
Completing refurbish Downtown Disney, which again, I've seen and it will be awesome.
And continue to put out movies that like Frozen which is amazing.,
Not to mention the customer service is still top notch and the park is beautiful.

I'm really not sure what all you want.

[TheVBs]

DH and DD13 enjoy thrill rides, DD9 and I do not. We'd love to see Harry Potter world at Universal, but at the moment, it just doesn't have enough to offer the whole family to warrant the price tag. However, we all currently enjoy the immersive experience WDW gives us. There are so many things we all enjoy there. I think this is at least partially an apples to oranges comparison, but take that with a grain of salt since we haven't actually been to Universal.

We don't exclusively vacation at WDW, or Disney properties. I think that's partially key to the level of enjoyment of our WDW trips. If the magic is gone for you, there are so many other places to go that are amazing! Places besides Universal. Places that aren't theme parks. You can create wonderful memories on so many different kinds of trips.

If we ever have a WDW trip that we think wasn't worth the money we paid, or if we thought it had lost the magic, we would simply choose another destination. So far, that hasn't happened. I'm not negating anyone else's experiences, but in return, don't negate ours. We are by no stretch of the imagination Disney "suckers". We still have a wonderful time there, so we continue to go every couple of years. Not singling anyone out, but as a good example, if we ever came to think of it as a "mouse trap" we would never even consider putting our money there.

I don't think there's anything wrong with saying here, if you don't think Disney is earning your money, don't give it to them. Try other destinations, then if you feel like it down the road, try Disney again and see if they've earned your money back.

[DizneyFreak2002]

The park is not very well kept up, a lot of chipping paint, not a very good lay out and not a real family atmosphere.

For a minute there, I thought you were describing WDW over the last 10-20 years... Cause there are plenty of areas with chipping paint, dead lightbulbs which cause an eyesore, DHS has a terrible lay out, and the family atmosphere is disappearing with rude CMs and horrible, despicable guests...

Harry Potter area was cool. but I couldnt' go on the rides because of my size. I'm big, but not that big. Never had a problem on any disney ride, but couldn't ride any of the rides at Universal.

How big are you exactly? You say not that big... Well, i'm a big guy too, and yet I fit into their rides just fine... Dragon Challenge and Hulk have two seats per train for "larger" guests (wider shoulder harnesses) and each "bench" in Potter have two wider seats on the outside of each vehicle to fit larger guests... Again, I fit with no problem in the larger seats... And even Mummy has larger seats, something I just learned this year... I saw a family have to move from the front of the vehicle to the back cause the back of the train had larger seats for the husband/dad...

The OP was talking about, and we are talking about WDW not the Disney company in general... So, with that said, half your list of what Disney is doing can be eliminated...

1. A complete new fantasyland that is amazing - style over substance... Disney used to be about style AND substance... The new Fantasyland area has style, just no substance... BTW, TDO didn't even want the new Fantasyland area... They were force to accept it... And with that, they wanted bare minimum...

2. Opened up Art of Animation Resort - On property which sat rotting for 10 years before they built over priced family suites...

3. Completely redid California Adventure - has nothing to do with WDW..

4. Built an awesome new area in California Adventure in Cars Land - again, has nothing to do with WDW

5. Have updated numerous cues and continue on that. - you mean those annoying interactive queues? The HM one is a travesty and ruins the ambiance of the HM... Remember, the HM is supposed to give the aura of foreboding... That headache inducing, cartoon nonsense takes that away... BTW, they are not going to be "updating" any more queues... The Nextgen nonsense has balloon and has now begun to take money away from other projects...

6. Updated Stars Tours - you mean the Star Tours TDO did not want? You mean the new Star Tours update Burbank forced down TDO's throat? TDO didn't want the new update, and if they had to have it, only wanted a bare minimum refurb... Again, Burbank forced their hand...

7. Opened up a resort in Hawaii - again, nothing to do with WDW...

8. Started a brand new land in Avitar
announced a complete new update to Animal Kingdom that I have seen the plans and it's amazing - Announced 3 years ago and we still have little idea about what is supposed to be in the land... You saw the plans or the concept art? If you work behind the scenes and saw the plans, good for you... if you are talking concept art, well, remember, nothing ever looks like the artist rendering... All they is coming to Avatar is a boat ride and a Soarin clone... Hardly something that makes me want to visit there right now... Maybe they can surprise me, but lately, Disney hasn't surprised anyone... BTW, don't know if you noticed but, other than FP+ and this MyTragic nonsense, Avatar has been met with a load of negativity from the fan base... Not a ringing endorsement I would say...

9. Completing refurbish Downtown Disney, which again, I've seen and it will be awesome. - again, you seen plans or concept art/models? What is so awesome about it? More stores (BTW what stores are coming?)... It is your typical outdoor lifestyle center/mall... Nothing which makes me say HEY I WANNA GO VISIT WDW CAUSE DTD IS GOING TO LOOK SO AWESOME!!! Oh and it only took them what, 5 to 6 years before deciding to do something about the mess that is DTD????

10. And continue to put out movies that like Frozen which is amazing. - again, nothing to do with WDW...

11. Not to mention the customer service is still top notch and the park is beautiful. - Parks have looked much better in the past... Customer Service has dipped extremely low... CMs are much more rude than ever... CMs show they don't care anymore, much more than in the past... WDW's customer service has declined, much like the rest of WDW...

[Tekneek]

Overall, there has been less and less to do at WDW over the past decade. As the prices started to jump faster and faster, attractions were shuttered and not replaced with anything. We can debate the quality of the current attractions, but the trend of paying more for less is well established. Some feel that a WDW vacation was under-priced before and still offers a competitive value, while others do not.

[mom2morgan]

I DO love Potter, and we always travel over to Universal for a day or two. But I am so mind-boggled and confused by all this "change" at Disney, and I'm actually THINKING of staying on-site at Universal for 3 days then coming over to Disney for a few. That will be a radical change for me and I don't know if I like it...but it would also let me take advantage of Universal's front of the line privileges. Although I'm against that in principle because I always thought it was elitist...at least it is a little more straightforward!

[PirateLover]

I'm not negating anyone else's experiences, but in return, don't negate ours. We are by no stretch of the imagination Disney "suckers". We still have a wonderful time there, so we continue to go every couple of years. Not singling anyone out, but as a good example, if we ever came to think of it as a "mouse trap" we would never even consider putting our money there.

I'm the one that used those terms, and I don't care about being "singled out." Mouse trap was more of a tongue-in-cheek term and I didn't coin it... but honestly, I do feel that is exactly what Disney is focused on with the My Magic stuff. They are interested in NEW guests who will stay exclusively on their property. They know they have us repeat guests hooked and it will take a LOT for us NOT to go back. As has been mentioned, a lot of us complain yet we continue to go back because we still love the ambiance and also, the nostalgic feeling of being back "home."

Tekneek's last post really articulated how we are feeling. We still love Disney, but at Walt Disney World, prices continue to go up but not much is added. That's all. Not negating anyone's experience are calling you suckers- just saying how we are starting to feel when we take a step back and look at this objectively.

[Ian]

Guys, let's try and refrain from the bullet point-style rebuttals of other folks' posts and the extensive back-and-forth debating.

Make your point once and then let others have their turns. All that ever comes from the debating stuff is hurt feelings, reported posts, and the thread ending up closed.

[Prudence]

I can see universal being good for a family with teenagers seeking thrill rides. For our family with multi-generations traveling, it didn't offer much. I found the food to be terrible compared to disney parks (especially since I'm a vegetarian) and the workers were very aggressive in trying to sell us meal plans and credit cards as we entered. I like the Spider-Man ride, but that was about it for me - maybe I'd like the other side of universal better than ioa. Couldn't handle the crowds at potter. Just a lousy day and waste of money for us, but I can see it being good for people with different interests.

[JerseyDad]

I'm the one that used those terms, and I don't care about being "singled out." Mouse trap was more of a tongue-in-cheek term and I didn't coin it... but honestly, I do feel that is exactly what Disney is focused on with the My Magic stuff. They are interested in NEW guests who will stay exclusively on their property. They know they have us repeat guests hooked and it will take a LOT for us NOT to go back. As has been mentioned, a lot of us complain yet we continue to go back because we still love the ambiance and also, the nostalgic feeling of being back "home."

Tekneek's last post really articulated how we are feeling. We still love Disney, but at Walt Disney World, prices continue to go up but not much is added. That's all. Not negating anyone's experience are calling you suckers- just saying how we are starting to feel when we take a step back and look at this objectively.

........I too .....am one that "loves" Disney ....and for that reason ....am completely disappointed about the pronounced downturn in service ....and value.

.........as a person that 'discovered' WDW 10 yrs ago at the age of 43 (when we could finally afford to go) .....and returned each year over the those years ....it's absolutely NOT hard to stop going. 2014 will be a year with no WDW trip for us. I was always acutely aware of the premium cost associated with a WDW vacation ......but continued to return each year, because I knew "what I was going to get" for my money. The past 2 years however ....I saw a definitive downturn ....in food, customer service, and upkeep. Our last trip in August .....was the first time ever ...that I returned home angry ....because I felt as if I was ripped off. The 'value' ...was not there.

.....for those experiencing WDW for the 1st time ...it will always feel like the best thing since sliced bread. However, to a frequent visitor ...who remembers when the bread was freshly baked, freshly sliced, and its enticing aroma permeated every corner of every venue ....it's now a leftover slice that's become quite stale.

....in a tough economy .....I don't think it'll be so hard for people to make a choice that will bring them more bang for their buck.

[DonaldDuckUSA]

We are creatures of habit, so when something new comes along that we don't understand we are HIGHLY skeptical. I say let the Fastpass+ stuff play out. I kind of like the idea of not having to half-sprint and throw elbows at rope drop getting to some of these attractions (like TSM) to get Fast Passes.

I think a lot of these concerns are partly from burnout and oversaturation. I read these boards and see all these posters that go every year, sometimes multiple times a year.

I agree.

DBF and I are not renewing our annual passes, partly because of cost, but partly because of burn out. Don't get me wrong, we still LOVE it, but we are taking a break. I think we've lost some of the magic on our last few trips. We've simply done it all.

I am SO impressed with what Universal has done in the past ten years. SO IMPRESSED. However, maybe it's just me, but the quality is still not there. I rarely (save two rides) get motion sickness at Disney, but I get it on all Universal rides (new HP ride included). To me, Disney still does it better.

Say what you want, but park attendance is exploding. Disney must be doing something right.

We've lost the magic, but give it two years and we'll be kids all over again, Mickey hat and all.

[CaptSmee]

I was just at Universal this week & even though it was busy, we rode everything in the park, literally (minus the minion ride) in a few hours (wirhout express pass). We saw the Animal Actors & Horror makeup shows & could have left before dinner but I wanted to stick around to watch the nighttime show.

My point being sure Disney has half day parks, but neither Universal park is a full day park. Do I still enjoy them, sure I do. There's some good stuff there.

My only other observation about the Universal park this week is that there is absolutely no theming left to the park now (minus the simpsons section). The giant transformers building is so subtle...

[Jen1984]

I have to say that I'm one of those who love Universal, and any trip for my family wouldn't be complete without spending at least two days there. I'm certainly not a thrill ride person (I get scared by Splash/Space Mountain and have still yet to go on EE) but I do love the rides in Universal. I can never understand it when people say there is nothing to do in Universal. Despicable Me, Shrek 4D, ET, the Simpsons, Transformers, Mummy, Men in Black, Disaster, Terminator, Rip Ride Rockit (which obviously I wouldn't even contemplate going on) plus a couple of shows. On a rough estimate, I'd say at least 6 of those are from the last 10 years, not to mention IOA, and the future HP update. Every time we travel there it seems like there is something new, big and exciting to look forward to.

We're heading back to WDW in March, and we're staying on site- I had fierce opposition from DBF as we could have stayed at Universal's RPR for the same money as POFQ, with some extra benefits (FOTL pass), but I love the atmosphere of Disney, particularly Epcot. Fastpass+ isn't such an issue for us, we do usually prefer to head to the theme parks later on in the day, so to have those guaranteed rides is a big plus point for us, so that certainly isn't the reason we're spending time at Universal. I do also find the restaurant standards and theming a lot more enjoyable at Disney, (at US/IOA only Tchoup Tchoup wowed us), but I'm sure there are plenty of naysayers to disagree with that! I'm not one for the DDP, and I only book a couple of ADR's but we still manage to eat very well.

I suppose my (very long-winded!) point is that I completely agree with the OP that Universal is fantastic and spends money where it counts for the consumer, but Disney certainly still does have a place for me!

[zipadeedoodah]

I am a die-hard WDW fan, but I have to agree unfortunately, with these rants. I am less than enthused with the directions that Disney has been choosing to go in WDW lately. Fastpass+ just sounds like a mess. (I leave tomorrow for a WDW/Universal trip, so I will report back on what my opinions are) So far, my disappointments haven't begun to keep me from wanting to go back each and every year, however I do see that happening eventually if they continue down this path. I spent thousands of dollars each year at WDW, and more and more often, I am finding myself leaving the parks feeling frustrated instead of having a magical experience. Maybe somebody needs to print off these comments and send them to Disney.

[jclightchasr]

I'm one of the few people that could care less about Harry Potter
I do look forward to what Disney has upcoming & think that the competition from universal will push them to develop more

No you are not IMO (and this only applies to me not others) I consider Universal blasphemous.

[joonyer]

Maybe some people are not fans of Harry Potter, but millions of people are. And at any rate the point is that Universal is spending $billions on new "state-of the art" attractions and supporting themed areas that attract new customers away from other theme parks. Whether you like the story behind them or not, those new attractions are immensely popular. There is certainly an advantage for WDW purists in the short term, if significantly more WDW guests start visiting other theme parks. That just leaves more WDW for the rest of us. But that is not good for WDW in the long term.

Yes, Disney has spent millions on some new attractions and themed areas (new Fantasyland) but let's face the facts. In the current times, the tales of Harry Potter are way more popular than Beauty and the Beast or Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs.

Disney is counting on spending billions on new technology that is supposed to make visiting its theme parks easier, but so far seems to be frustrating its repeat customers. I have always loved WDW and still do, so I am hoping this all works out differently than it seems right to be now and ends up making WDW even better than it used to be. My fingers are crossed.

[tomwitham]

Well you just got me thinking just how amazing a Firefly Land would be.

/dream

I'll be in my bunk.