5th Disney Theme Park Coming Soon?

[Ian]

Here's an idea, why not add to the existing parks AND add a fifth park. I don't buy into the excuse that the theme park market is saturated. I think it's all about creating quality attractions that will entice guests to make return visits.

It's not about the market being saturated or return visits, and it's not about whether or not people here think it would be nice to have a 5th park.

The fact is it would be economic lunacy to build a 5th gate at WDW right now. There is absolutely no additional profit to be made from it, so there's no possible way to justify spending well north of one billion dollars to add a new gate. Not when you could spend less than 50% of that, get the same result, and not increase your operating expenses even one iota.

[Stu29573]

Will there be a 5th park?- Yes
Will it be soon?- No

[Supercali]

Give me about 6 years and we'll see.

[Donald Duck 224]

I think the 5th park will come around 2015

[Grizz16]

If and when there is a 5th park, it will probably be Pixar related, which would mean no MK full of Pixar rides

[lockedoutlogic]

There is a larger issue that is tied to this recurring discussion:

Is it possible that some day (possibly soon) that WDW will become saturated to the point where expansion is not beneficial or realistic?

This is something that has been in the back of my mind since my tenure as a Disney emp.....and it still gnaws at me....

What is the limit to that tract of land....and I don't mean the actual physical space...I mean what is the economic limit? how long before it doesn't make sense to expand further?

It would be nice if someday there is 100 resorts, 10 parks, a subway network, 8 waterparks, and 300 restaurants....but there will be a breaking point long before that....

I'm sure they'll get to 10,000 shops though

Anyway, all this talk of expansion gets my mind off the tracks....though I agree with many posters in thinking that a new gate will only arrive after extensive reinvestment in the existing parks...as it should be.

Instead of new parks (which would undoubtedly run way over budget and open after downscaling - as they all have), I would be much more enthused in largescale development of MGM and AK....which is entirely possible...rather than adding more turnstyles...

Here's my ideas for both:

MGM
Divert the new Pixar market into attractions for the studios...thereby increasing the youth appeal of the park...
Get with Lucas and replace the stunt show...the main argument as to why Indiana Jones hasn't been changed is the amount of volume it handles...in case anyone has ever been to MGM there hasn't been a crowd to handle!!
Time for a real attraction...as in California and Paris...still shocking that this hasn't been done in Florida yet.
Get with Lucas and replace Star Tours with a real attraction...don't care what type...but this may the least imaginative use of an entertainment franchise with as much potential as Star Wars in any theme park on earth....it's time to reinvent

AK

Continue (or start...if not true) the negotiations with the Chinese Government and secure Giant Pandas. This would bring instant credibility, Star Power, and a great conservation aspect to the park....and pandas are so unique that it would suite disney's interests because they are not a "typical" zoo attraction...such as a tiger in a cage....
Develop another themed land...with Australia being a slam dunk and an easy sell to the customer. The animals are fairly adaptive and should provide alot of fun. You could throw another E-ticket in there...I would suggest an adaptation of Soarin'...which would be good for all ages and interesting...and maybe a rip-off Australian Steak/Sea Restaurant......this is easy development by Disney standards
A dedicated children's area....because let's face it: the boneyard and Chester and Hester isn't cutting it...
Speaking of...they should get rid of Chester and Hester...
And finally, MORE RESTAURANTS...nix restraurantosaurus and put at least 2 new quality table service locations...in addition to the new landry's near everest

[Surfer Stitch]

I wish i had a buck for every time I heard this one. as much as I wish there was a new park I really think improvements are needed at the current parks first. Epcot, MGM and MK could all do with some cleaning up and AK def would benefit from a new addition. I'd rather see the third park if built be here in the US but as Figment said if built it will more than likely be overseas.

[Jeany031]

i wanted to see disney-pixar studios with a the incredibles live show. I hope it will work.

[MickeysDad]

There is a larger issue that is tied to this recurring discussion:

Is it possible that some day (possibly soon) that WDW will become saturated to the point where expansion is not beneficial or realistic?

Yes. Its just about here. But like I said earlier they need to make DAK and MGM full day parks first to increase single day tickets

[Ian]

Is it possible that some day (possibly soon) that WDW will become saturated to the point where expansion is not beneficial or realistic?

That's pretty much what I've been getting at all along ...

[lockedoutlogic]

That's pretty much what I've been getting at all along ...

I don't think they are quite there yet....but the last 15 years of development have given the public the false sense that things will continue as they have...which doesn't seem realistic


Right now...what other than DVC is under large scale development? It could be quite sometime before a major area is unveiled.
The best we can hope for now are quality attractions that add to the depth of the existing WDW...and erase the ugly memory of Chester and Hester, Magic Carpets of Aladdin, Stitch, and JIYI....
Everest is a good start...but much more is needed.

[Ian]

I don't think they are quite there yet....

I think that, not only are they already there, that they've actually gone a little beyond where they should have.

They have created a very untenable situation in WDW. The resort is too big for its own good. Its caused major staffing issues (both in terms of quality and pure head count), it gives them transportation headaches, and it's created a maintenance nightmare.

Right now...what other than DVC is under large scale development? It could be quite sometime before a major area is unveiled.
The best we can hope for now are quality attractions that add to the depth of the existing WDW...and erase the ugly memory of Chester and Hester, Magic Carpets of Aladdin, Stitch, and JIYI....
Everest is a good start...but much more is needed.

I agree 100% ... and I hope it stays this way.

[GrumpyFan]

While a 5th gate will probably appear sometime down the road, WDW is nowhere near ready to handle it. As mentioned by others, staffing and maintaining the existing structure (resorts, parks, transportation, etc), is already a big task that they're having trouble handling. Just take a look around at what's happening in the parks. Epcot and MGM are in need of modernization/refreshing, probably Epcot more than MGM, but still both need something done to keep them fresh. And, while Expedition Everest was a great improvement for AK, there is still lots of room for that park to grow.

I, for one, would much rather see more improvements to Epcot and MGM, adding another land or two to AK, and making some major changes to the transportation system (monorail, light rail, etc) before they even break ground on the 5th park.

[lockedoutlogic]

I think that, not only are they already there, that they've actually gone a little beyond where they should have.

They have created a very untenable situation in WDW. The resort is too big for its own good. Its caused major staffing issues (both in terms of quality and pure head count), it gives them transportation headaches, and it's created a maintenance nightmare.

I agree 100% ... and I hope it stays this way.

There is a simple explanation for this problem....
Micheal Eisner and "the disney decade"

In many discussions with longtime employees...it is quite clear that the 1990's...while producing unprecedented growth for disney parks....absolutely killed the workforce's overall quality, skill, and work ethic....
Through the 1980's...working at WDW was generally coveted and considered a privilege...and honor by many....but Mikey Eisner changed that....
Now working for disney is "where should my next job be: Universal, Disney, or Bennigans on 192"....
I'm not exaggerating..the reason why they can't keep staff is because they have lowered their standards in order to squeeze more money out of the operation and in the process...run through the entire available labor pool. They now depend on completely inexperienced and unskilled workers, supplimented by international and american college indentured servitude (i kid not...the "college program" and "international program" are operated basically like a russian feudal era serfdom...mandated work with practically no compensation in return)...they've even killed their management personnel because the pay is generally below industry average and there is in many cases - literally- no opportunity for upward mobility. Managers bounce from location to location to location....laterally...without promotion or sufficient compensation increases...

But WDW is what it is....a pillar revenue source for all of disney's exploits....including supporting the many bad media and technology moves they've made in the last 10 years....and therefore is burdened by the necessity of operating at maximum profit while eliminating as much overhead as possible.

Unfortunately the elimination of money also decreases quality....as it has since the dawn of civilization and will continue to for the forseeable future....

[Not2Loud]

Ok, I know I am not the expert on this, but why not through in my 2 cents anyways!

Is a 5th park really needed? I don't think so at this point in time. A family has a hard time seeing everything WDW offers today within a weeks timeframe. Some would argue I am sure, but think of all the little things there are to do and see. In fact, these would probably be things I would continue to add and expand. Having things within the complex for families to do without going to parks is a plus. We are staying for 11 days next month (longest trip yet), and honestly, I look forward to the days we don't go to the parks. Then again, I could be happy riding the monorail all day just looking out the windows. I look forward to watching the movies at the campfire at Ft. Wilderness, I look forward to strolling at the Boardwalk, playing with LEGO's, etc. I am glad to spend my money at WDW, but I don't need another park to do so (with the possible exception of a water park where River Country once was).

With all this said, this will be the first time I have stayed on WDW property since '89. I finally decided I hated leaving the "magic" each day. While it may cost a few dollars more, I haven't been this excited about a vacation in quite some time.

I will quite my mindless babbling now, thanks for the space to share!!

[kai2234]

My DH's friend just returned from taking his family to WDW. He says he spoke to a cast member who couldn't give any details, but stated that WDW was building a 5th Theme Park to be announced in 2007 or 08.

Can any of our cast member friends confirm this?

Please realize that an hourly CM that works at a park is most likely NOT going to know this information. I just don't want you getting excited.

Now, if you spoke to an Industrial Engineer for WDI, they may know of projects in the works. The catch? They would not release the information to you.

Just know that the information given to a "front-line" CM is on a need-to-know basis, and future developments/ticket price increases, etc don't fall into this category.

[Ian]

There is a simple explanation for this problem....
Micheal Eisner and "the disney decade"

In many discussions with longtime employees...it is quite clear that the 1990's...while producing unprecedented growth for disney parks....absolutely killed the workforce's overall quality, skill, and work ethic....
Through the 1980's...working at WDW was generally coveted and considered a privilege...and honor by many....but Mikey Eisner changed that....
Now working for disney is "where should my next job be: Universal, Disney, or Bennigans on 192"....
I'm not exaggerating..the reason why they can't keep staff is because they have lowered their standards in order to squeeze more money out of the operation and in the process...run through the entire available labor pool. They now depend on completely inexperienced and unskilled workers, supplimented by international and american college indentured servitude (i kid not...the "college program" and "international program" are operated basically like a russian feudal era serfdom...mandated work with practically no compensation in return)...they've even killed their management personnel because the pay is generally below industry average and there is in many cases - literally- no opportunity for upward mobility. Managers bounce from location to location to location....laterally...without promotion or sufficient compensation increases...

But WDW is what it is....a pillar revenue source for all of disney's exploits....including supporting the many bad media and technology moves they've made in the last 10 years....and therefore is burdened by the necessity of operating at maximum profit while eliminating as much overhead as possible.

Unfortunately the elimination of money also decreases quality....as it has since the dawn of civilization and will continue to for the forseeable future....

You said this absolutely perfectly. I agree 100%!

[LudwigVonDrake]

Please realize that an hourly CM that works at a park is most likely NOT going to know this information. I just don't want you getting excited..

At least they didn't hear it from a bus driver

[Jasper]

It is not surprising that rumors like this come up every now and then. It is also not surprising when someone says they saw a memo or talked to someone involved in a meeting about new parks or new attractions.

The reason these things are not surprising? Any company that is looking for continued revenue growth is going to be constantly looking at all of their options, including new parks. That means creative people will meet, staff will write memos and reports, and bean counters will analyze the validity of these proposals. That means you will have a never ending supply of opportunity for rumors.

And yes, the change of people in charge of various areas will often times add fuel to the fire because these new people will want to see if they can find an existing plan that may have been overlooked which can allow them to get things moving quickly. Even though this is all a normal part of business it does become more pronounced when it is Disney.

The bottom line? Planning is normal, planning will create opportunities for rumors, don't put much stock in the rumors until there is an offical announcement!

[hockeymom]

I thought that I heard somewhere that a "Sea World" like park in on the agenda for Florida.