The Cuts... They Just Keep on Coming

I just read a thread from 2012 called Are these the "Dark Days" of Disney World? It is an interesting read as to how much it mirrors what is being posted in 2016.
It concerns me that WDW expects us as guests to plan our vacation so far out when we have no way of knowing if that ride we planned our day around will actually be operational that day,if the weather will cooperate with our plans or if we will even be hungry for that $200 meal that we have committed our vacation dollars to. The whole concept seems to set the bar so high that our expectations can almost never be met.

baldburke;2478794 wrote: So rather than bashing Disney, why not start your own Universal-COT where you can laud all the wonders of Universal? Disney is no different than any other corporation, including Comcast - parent of Universal, in that they will do what's best for the shareholder. It is indeed a problem for our modern economy that so much value is place on the shareholder as opposed to the employee or the consumer. Maybe our next president will figure it out, but we are free market system and right now society values the shareholder over the other two components (employee and consumer). If your perceived value for your dollar isn't meeting your expectations then by all means spend it elsewhere! However there is a difference between constructive criticism and outright disgust as you've shown time and time again.

Boo yah!! Couldn't have said it better myself!!

Disney also made changes at The resorts namely Port Orleans riverside and french quarter.

From another website-Several new "Proprietor" roles have been created, which are an amalgamated department manager role covering more than one traditional line of business, Where this has caused some positions to disappear (such as in Food & Beverage, Recreation and Merchandising) those staff have been redeployed as Duty Managers at different resorts and there have been no enforced job losses - although at least one retiree who oversaw Food & Beverage across multiple Sassagoula area resorts has not been replaced. A few hourly positions have been lost or reorganized too - such as the roving iPad-wielding additional check in staff - but those CMs have been rotated into other roles within the same departments.
I think this will be happening other places as well

It is possible (and probably good) to love something and be critical of it at the same time. I feel that way about Disney Parks very often. I absolutely LOVE Disneyland. Love everything about it. However, I am also getting increasingly irritated with the crowding situation there and Disney's apparent lack of concern for how it affects the guest experience. They keep trying to pack more and more people in, offering completely unnecessary ticket specials to lure in more and more locals (who they block out on the APs on the weekends because of crowds). Just when the holiday crowds have died down, they do something to boost attendance even more. This drives me crazy. This feels like straight up greed. But, that doesn't mean I don't still enjoy going, or I don't have a great time every visit with my family. It's a love/hate thing.

Here, at Epcot, in particular, we have the opposite situation. There is so little to do, but rather than entice people to come with new things (which at least Disneyland is doing) they are cutting further back on the things offered, without realizing that all those people in the park now have even LESS options. It's completely backwards. If a ride isn't popular, or people aren't spending money in your shops and you're losing money on running those things, maybe think about how to make them BETTER? Don't just shut the doors and give up. That's where I see the biggest issue here. That said, I still LOVE Epcot. And there is nothing wrong with feeling both ways.

For the time being, we are sticking with Disneyland. Luckily we live a stone's throw away and so can time our visits to avoid huge crowd times. I haven't felt like returning to WDW for quite some time. And that is a new feeling for me. I'm willing to give them some time to work on the current projects and am hopeful that Epcot is next in line to receive some love. When they set out to completely overhaul a park, they have the ability to do amazing things. Here's hoping.

DizneyFreak2002;2478690 wrote: For a company that just made more money last quarter than ever before, you'd never know it with WDW... With the way cuts are being made left and right in WDW, you'd think WDW was going out of business... But when money is all that matters, and guest satisfaction means nothing anymore, do you really expect anything else?

The only problem I have with this statement, is that companies usually make decisions like these based on forecast, not what happened in the past. Quite frankly, just based on the complaints I have seen on this discussion board in the last few weeks, it would not surprise me if Disney is forecasting a horrible year for the Parks and Resorts division.

I keep waiting for Disney to do something to get me back. And every time, it seems they just push me further and further out. We're doing two cruises this year, been enjoying them so much. I've been going for years like many others and agree, it's probably easier to spot the cuts than maybe first time visitors, however I know quite a few people that have recently come back from trips of a lifetime and have no desire to go back; wasn't magical (or as magical as they expected). So I don't think it's just the vets that are seeing the wrong...

And while I don't have an MBA, I just don't get the raise prices upon a weak forecast . You can call it cuts, restructuring, etc. It's a price increase. Less for more... We'll be looking at a ticket increase soon enough, and shorter hours are a disguise for a ticket price increase. So we're looking at at least two ticket increases for 2016, probably more...

If you are right, Speedy, that these cuts might be based on forecasts, then Disney will have brought it on themselves. Like John, my history with Walt Disney World goes back to the mid 70's. The Magic Kingdom and EPCOT Center (beginning in 1982) were the best of the best and I would visit at least once per year and often twice to be lost in the magic. But even then, I can't recall the Odyssey Restaurant being open much after 1983 or so.

My wife and I made our last visit in 2004 when our daughter was 10. By then, Future World was a shell of itself, we really had no interest in the Studios and, at the time, Animal Kingdom was, at best, a half-day park. And everything was at premium price. We decided as a family that we wanted our memories of Disney to be of when it was truly a magical place. And so, we put our money elsewhere and we have not regretted it.

I've been coming to these boards since 2002, all the while wishing that I would hear good news that might make me want to return. I've been disappointed because I feel strongly that the cutbacks over the years have hurt the show more than anything. All the while, the dreamers have given way to the suits who not only have no clue, but are only invested as far as their golden parachutes and stock options will take them.

One day I hope to return. But it will not be to a place where vacation is more of a job and a hassle than relaxation and fun.

BrerGnat;2478729 wrote: The only one on that list that surprises me is the Mouse Gear cut. The rest are likely because NO ONE is going on those attractions anyway. Might as well shut them down while they figure out what the heck they are going to do to improve Epcot.

.....well ....I'd hate to think that I'm the only person in the Universe that loves ...and goes on "Living With The Land". I don't see it as needing "improvement" ....only a tweak here and there. The educational aspects of Disney fascinate the heck out of me.

John;2478845 wrote: Agree with some here the criticism is ok (and at least in my mind - valid) but the way you take personal anyone who disagrees with you Bobby is disturbing and really needs to stop.

Now, to everyone else...

Look, I've been going since 1976 - so I have a lot of perspective. The last time I saw this kind of disregard for the parks was right before there was almost a takeover and split up of the company - which eventually lead to Eisner coming into power. Great book called Storming the Magic Kingdom: Wall Street, The Raiders and the Battle for Disney - by John Taylor ( Amazon has it from 1 cent http://amzn.to/1okIEhE )

I am hopeful that things like the Star Wars Land and Pandora additions to the park will start to turn the tide but right now, it's hard to see that far out. All I see is increasing prices and declining value - and that makes me, a super long time visitor sad. Especially the direction of my favorite Epcot which is a shell of it's former self. Sad to the point where (as others have said), we're going elsewhere for now. I don't feel like I've left the magic, I feel like the magic has left me. And it's not just me, it's friends, family and co-workers I talk to as well.

Now, stepping back - I am totally and completely certain that much of what many of us see as decline, the average park goer doesn't see much at all. In fact, when cuts are implemented, I'm sure it's done with a thought to what effects park operations.

However, I don't want Disney to be that kind of company. I want them to be what they show on their commercials - the one that exceeds expectations and goes the extra mile. That values their guests above profit (ok, that may be a bit too far) - but you get the idea. I want it to be everything that Walt dreamed it could be.

That 92 members have read this thread to date shows me - people DO care and want things to improve. I could go on much longer - but I'll just say this...

DISNEY CAN DO BETTER.

Without vocalizing our collective displeasure, as the thread title says, the cuts will keep on coming - but there is a right and wrong way to do it. Be kind to your fellow member and respect them like you are speaking in person.

As Stephen R. Covey said in the 7 habits of highly effective people - SEEK FIRST TO UNDERSTAND, THEN to be understood.

Keep it civil. This is an important topic that needs to be discussed. I don't want to have to shut it down because a few people on both sides can't keep their emotions in check.

Thank you John :mickey:
I don't mind disagreeing

, but it's in the presentation ;) Being nice to our fellow members as you said.

I really hope SW Land helps DS. I've never been a fan myself of DS, so I'm hoping I'll find a new love for it.
I have come to adore AK, only after the birth of my sons and seeing it through their eyes over the years. I think the new Rivers of Light and Pandora should be a wonderful attraction to enhance a park already packed with so much to learn and do IMHO

Another positive vote here for "Living with the Land".

best,

...............john

I clarified later that I meant that those attractions see DRAMATIC attendance drop off between the hours of 7 and 9pm. Likely due to people having dinner and getting ready to watch Illuminations, but that side of the park, save for Soarin', is usually pretty deserted after 7pm.

I too love the Land boat ride. Always have.

JerseyDad;2478869 wrote: .....well ....I'd hate to think that I'm the only person in the Universe that loves ...and goes on "Living With The Land". I don't see it as needing "improvement" ....only a tweak here and there. The educational aspects of Disney fascinate the heck out of me.

I like the Land too - even have taken the behind the seeds tour. That said, even that ride could use some TLC. Disappointed they took the human element out of it but that aside, the films in the beginning are from the 1980's and really need updating badly. How hard would that be to do? Show us what's going on in the 2016 and beyond agriculture wise. Surely there has been advancements since the time when Duran Duran ruled the charts! Why not also incorporate some new growing methods as well during the ride?

Finally, the fish tanks that have a single shrimp in them or a single eel where they used to be filled are kind of bad show in my opinion. Looking at huge Plexiglas tubes with one thing in them just isn't entertaining.

Overall, still like the ride, but as with other things in Epcot, it really could use some love.

The real reason for the cuts has been in the press and on many other boards. It's cost overruns at Shanghai and losses at Disneyland Paris. The company's Parks division has to find cost savings to cope with these issues. Typical of most companies, all parts of a division have to help with the bottom line when one part of the division falters. This isn't a WDW management in their infinite wisdom type decision it's above them at corporate level. Learn the facts before you bash.

WiltonJohn;2478874 wrote: Another positive vote here for "Living with the Land".

best,

...............john

John;2478876 wrote: I like the Land too - even have taken the behind the seeds tour. That said, even that ride could use some TLC. Disappointed they took the human element out of it but that aside, the films in the beginning are from the 1980's and really need updating badly. How hard would that be to do? Show us what's going on in the 2016 and beyond agriculture wise. Surely there has been advancements since the time when Duran Duran ruled the charts! Why not also incorporate some new growing methods as well during the ride?

Finally, the fish tanks that have a single shrimp in them or a single eel where they used to be filled are kind of bad show in my opinion. Looking at huge Plexiglas tubes with one thing in them just isn't entertaining.

Overall, still like the ride, but as with other things in Epcot, it really could use some love.

And another vote for LwtL! It's one of my favorites!
I do agree that I miss the human guides though, and they would often answer questions!
I would love to see some updating to see what has changed in the realm of food growth and the movement to become more "clean eating".

John;2478876 wrote:
Overall, still like the ride, but as with other things in Epcot, it really could use some love.

Kinda like some people in this thread. They could really use some love.